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Post by bbbearsmom on Jul 31, 2018 0:12:20 GMT
Wow, some discussion here. At my meeting tonight the leader said the word from corporate was they were to meet the meeting member where they were at. In other words if they don't use a smart phone they write the info in their booklet. I was told that since I'm on the app I could write my weight in my book if I wanted to but they wouldn't be doing it. Reason: they want us to become more involved in our weight loss. They also want us writing more in our "Success Story" booklet. The leader went through different things we might want to record in there other than our weight. She also covered the topic of NSV. Before the meeting she linked my online and meeting accounts so now I have all my weight since June of 2006 on my app. She said they got rid of the bravos because we should decide what gets celebrated they shouldn't be deciding what to celebrate. I sat there like a bump on a log.
I'm not into writing things in my booklet and I think that is because I have a number of online support groups, this one and two on FB. Using my online support network I don't need to write in the booklet but then I just might be jaded after doing this 12 years.
The downside is having the weight graph on the app really shows my weight gain since February. I'm not sure why although I know scientifically it is because I'm eating too much but my fall back is thinking my body changed. At least I'm tracking while I'm waiting for something to set a fire under me so I work harder at stopping this gain.
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Kitty
Transcendent Member
Posts: 1,448
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Post by Kitty on Jul 31, 2018 0:21:19 GMT
With getting rid of the 5 pound stickers and most charms -- well they still be celebrating weight losses in the meeting? That is, will a 5 pound loss be recognized or is that going by the wayside? I think the whole we get to decide what we celebrate is a cop out. I mean if no one wishes me happy birthday it can be argued I should decide if I celebrate my birthday. But, to me I want to be celebrated by other people not just me. I want the recognition from others and not just me. I like hearing Happy Birthday and I like to hear the nice words when I lose 5 pounds (or hit 10% or whatever). In all seriousness - for those of you who go to meetings, are you really going becuase you like having a book with a computerized label and bravo stickers? It's not for the feeling of community or whatever? I have never liked meetings so I'm asking this sincerely - I just truly don't see why these minor changes would really impact the value that I thought people were taking away from the meetings. It just seems like minutiae to me. I don't care whether they print or write the weights each week. I think it is faster/easier to print. But, back in the day, they did handwrite it and that was fine. What bothers me is the idea of not writing/typing it at all. I think having the physical record in the book is helpful to bring home the reality of it. To me, out of sight and out of mind. It is too easy for me to not realize I'm gaining. That said - I don't care that much about the weight loss sticker. I do care about getting rid of bravo stickers (some) and 5 pounds stickers (a lot). Having the visible rewards for losing weight has always helped me with motivation. When I first got to goal you had a cloth ribbon with cloth stars on it. Many people wore them to meetings, then it went to bookmarks and then to stars in the book. I thought those were mostly cost cutting. But, this seems to be different. it seems to be de-emphasizing rewarding weight loss. That concerns me. I do worry about people who don't use online. Yes, there are people who don't. Or they do in some things but not for WW. But they have to change. Meetings are not what will keep them profitable with the competition of free or low cost apps. Keeping meetings going would equal clinging to a sinking ship. Mindy must operate this business in a manner that maximizes shareholder wealth, not from a place of emotion. Personally if I was CEO I'd have closed down meetings ages ago, and channeled my energy and resources on being on par with the better free apps. It is very hard to compete with free if you provide the same thing free provides and you want to charge for it. Imagine WW without meetings. What does WW provide that MFP doesn't provide? If I track my food on MFP, go to their forums on some things, come here for other things...what do I exactly get from the online version of WW? I don't see that I get anything? The WW food plan? I don't believe there is any one "diet" that is great. There are lots of food plans that can work for people. I like the WW plan but I wouldn't pay for it. Their online program is the WW website (nothing special), the WW app (inferior to other free apps), WW connect (fine if you like it but you can find substitutes for free) and the WW food plan (not materially superior to counting calories or other mainstream free food plans). Why would I pay for that? What would be the reason? What would be the value? The value of WW is the meeting. You beat free by doing something that free can't give you. MFP and forums can't give me a meeting. That is where WW provides real value. The meeting with a leaders. Now, I think that WW could potentially hold online meetings with a live leader. I could see that happening. I am not sure WW could meet the technology requirements of that, but it would theoretically work. But, just getting rid of meetings and leaders? I don't see that as giving any value. Group support works. I don't think I would have ever gotten to lifetime without it. I would pay for the meetings, but never without the meetings (if I had to and had weight to lose of any substance I would pay for coaching).
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Post by linda72 on Jul 31, 2018 0:46:57 GMT
The value of WW is the meeting. This. The meeting with a leaders. Yes, absolutely. Group support works. I don't think I would have ever gotten to lifetime without it. This is what worked for me. I did the work but I received so much support and encouragement from these boards and from my meetings. Connect would never be enough for me to get to goal. Never.
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Post by bbbearsmom on Jul 31, 2018 1:17:01 GMT
But, this seems to be different. it seems to be de-emphasizing rewarding weight loss. That concerns me. This is what is happening. There is a movement that paying attention to weight and especially losing weight is bad and sends the wrong message. WW is promoting that you are more than your weight and that this "journey" is about more than losing weight. They are pushing the behavioral side of things. I just don't know if this is going to work. Funny thing is I'm somewhat into Beck and this is what Beck is about, how you lose weight and I always thought the meetings and WW were missing the points that Beck was teaching me. I liked the shift in meetings to more cognitive behavioral therapy type stuff but as I said I don't know how this is going to go. The bit about celebrations is people aren't going to know to stick up their hand and celebrate if they aren't encouraged and don't see it being done.
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Post by zazzles on Jul 31, 2018 1:26:33 GMT
Reason: they want us to become more involved in our weight loss. Well, that seems to be an area they can't make up their mind about. In one sentence they say weight is a number on the scale and not important, that how you feel about yourself is important. Then they make statements like the one you quoted about being more involved in our weight loss. Which is it: do we ignore weight or track it like a bloodhound. Again, WW talking out of both sides of their mouth IMHO. With getting rid of the 5 pound stickers and most charms -- well they still be celebrating weight losses in the meeting? That is, will a 5 pound loss be recognized or is that going by the wayside? I think the whole we get to decide what we celebrate is a cop out. But wouldn't it be interesting if the members in a meeting banded together outside the meeting and decided that they were each going to come up with something to celebrate every single week and take 5 minutes to do so. What would that do to their 30-minute-max meeting mandate!
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Post by finreporter on Jul 31, 2018 2:19:54 GMT
You guys are acting like I am the chief innovation officer at WW. I said they should get rid of meetings but I wouldn't know what exactly they should do to have the edge on the competition. But whatever they're doing now clearly isn't working. Young people don't want meetings. And WW is already losing in the tech aspect to the competitors. So either transform themselves in a fresh new way not thought of by anyone else or go the way of Kodak and Blockbuster by being slow as molasses to change and thinking they were #1 for far too long.
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Post by finreporter on Jul 31, 2018 2:31:06 GMT
Wrong thread
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Post by itsrad on Jul 31, 2018 2:37:11 GMT
You guys are acting like I am the chief innovation officer at WW. I said they should get rid of meetings but I wouldn't know what exactly they should do to have the edge on the competition. But whatever they're doing now clearly isn't working. Young people don't want meetings. And WW is already losing in the tech aspect to the competitors. So either transform themselves in a fresh new way not thought of by anyone else or go the way of Kodak and Blockbuster by being slow as molasses to change and thinking they were #1 for far too long. i think you are right. I think they are going the way of Kodak and Blockbuster. They are behind the tech curve and they aren't agile enough to fix the model. Instead of being innovative they are putting bandaids on it. Paper towels and "we can't fix the computers" really isn't going to solve their problems. Actually, it puts a spotlight on their problems. It makes me sad for the members have stayed loyal and care about the company. As far as the stockholders and Mindy and Oprah ...... well, enough said. If I had stock I would be divesting now, while it is close to its peak.
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Post by finreporter on Jul 31, 2018 2:55:06 GMT
Me too, rad.
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Post by borntexan on Jul 31, 2018 3:23:15 GMT
I do realize many of you go to meetings for accountability.I have also seen many post they also go to face the scale. Believe me when I say I understand and support all of the meetings members who like the support the meeting format gives you. I also feel your pain and angst over all the changes that have happened so quickly.
I guess I am one of the few who actually liked online only.This is how I reached goal.I did not like the leader at the only meeting even remotely close to where I live. I am not saying online only is for everyone.I am no better than anyone going to meetings. If it had not been for the original boards but mostly for this board and all of you supportive people I would never have made goal.You people are my meetings and I thank all of you for support.
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Post by hallian on Jul 31, 2018 3:52:13 GMT
So, I cancelled my online WW account today. I never wanted to go to meetings, so none of that mattered to me. What mattered to me was that I had no access to my meal plans beyond the past 90 days. Seems silly maybe, but I wanted to see what I was eating in February that was making my weight loss so successful.
I had spent several phone calls with tech support to find out why I couldn't access my past food journals beyond 90 days and it turns out that is WW policy. So today when I called to cancel my account, the representative wanted to know if she could access my account to see what the problem was. I told her no. I didn't need it confirmed. I already knew the answer. It then became a really strange phone call. Took her seconds to cancel my account.
I will continue to do what I've been doing because I have been successful following this WW plan, and I can document my meals on a spreadsheet and figure points with iTrackBites app or MFP. I realized that I only used the WW app to document my meals and scan for points. iTrackBites will do that. I don't think I've used a single recipe from the WW site and the Connect section is just ridiculous.
Oddly I feel relieved. Using the WW app had become a burden.
I'm sad that the WW meetings have changed so much. I know many people have been helped by WW meetings, so I think it's sad.
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Kitty
Transcendent Member
Posts: 1,448
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Post by Kitty on Jul 31, 2018 5:48:12 GMT
I did the work but I received so much support and encouragement from these boards and from my meetings. Connect would never be enough for me to get to goal. Never. Me either. I remember when I joined WW way back when some people said that I (and others) should be able to lose weight on our own. Maybe. But I couldn't. After I got to goal and quit meetings and regained, I tried joining online only since I knew how to do WW. I failed. I needed the group. Connect is not enough because it is hard to create community there and you don't have threading, etc. They could do online meetings with a set meeting with an actual leader and small group, perhaps. But just Connect? No. Not enough. WW is promoting that you are more than your weight and that this "journey" is about more than losing weight. They are pushing the behavioral side of things. I just don't know if this is going to work. Funny thing is I'm somewhat into Beck and this is what Beck is about, how you lose weight and I always thought the meetings and WW were missing the points that Beck was teaching me. I liked the shift in meetings to more cognitive behavioral therapy type stuff but as I said I don't know how this is going to go. I like the psychological stuff as well. I have a masters degree in social work and am a big believer in CBT and similar things. But -- a weight loss program has to also help with the weight loss part. But wouldn't it be interesting if the members in a meeting banded together outside the meeting and decided that they were each going to come up with something to celebrate every single week and take 5 minutes to do so. What would that do to their 30-minute-max meeting mandate! The leader at the meeting we've been going to since we moved has a thing at the start of the meeting where she asks the group if the week was thumbs up, thumbs down or thumbs sideways. It is optional whether to reply of course. It is usually a mix. This usually ends up taking at least half to 2/3 of the meeting. I do like it and it is helpful. You guys are acting like I am the chief innovation officer at WW. I said they should get rid of meetings but I wouldn't know what exactly they should do to have the edge on the competition. But whatever they're doing now clearly isn't working. Young people don't want meetings. And WW is already losing in the tech aspect to the competitors. So either transform themselves in a fresh new way not thought of by anyone else or go the way of Kodak and Blockbuster by being slow as molasses to change and thinking they were #1 for far too long. I am not sure I agree. I mean maybe WW will die. But, I think that chasing after young people to pay for WW is probably a losing proposition. There are exceptions, but most under 30 aren't going to spend a monthly fee for a weight loss program. Whether it is meetings or online. It isn't going to happen. I think that if they want to make meetings where under 30s will attend that is simply not going to happen. From their earnings calls their meetings are doing about as well as online. It isn't like meetings are tanking and online is going gangbusters. I just don't see WW getting younger people to do online only for a long period of time (remember WW relies on repeat customers). Many younger people do like tech (as do I and I'm not young) but they usually want it free. Maybe free with some ability to pay for extras. MFP is free. I am a premium member. It is $50 a year I think. Most people scoff at paying that. But, this may be a problem that WW can't solve and they will die. They have been doing better the last year or so, honestly. But they have had a lot of debt and I'm just not sure they can turn it around. borntexan, - I love the avatar. So cute.... hallian, I track in MFP and have 5 years worth of food records. I look back on them all the time to find stuff. You can also export it all.
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Post by louisstone on Jul 31, 2018 11:46:25 GMT
Run everything through your busy 35 y/o working mom filter and you have your answers.
First off - those ©£®&@$ Dymo printers. Great when they work and a nightmare when they don't. Our computers tell us the current weight, target and +- right on the screen. If we remember to write it down before finishing the process, it's no problem. Busy mom has her head staring down at her phone throughout the meeting anyway, so she can check her weight in between posting pics of her feet on Connect.
Name tags - it's a visual cue of who's checked in. If you're a leader counting heads to see if you'll have enough staffing for your spare receptionist next week, it's really helpful. And for someone like me that subs exclusively, it helps me better engage with a room full of strangers. Wear. The. Name. Tag. Busy mom is an individual with problems that no one in the world has ever experienced. She needs that name tag to clearly prove that she's unique.
Bare foot weighing. Considering I've fought for shoes on the scale for 9 years, I'm grateful. Years later, I can still remember the funk that came out of those rain boots from that lady that I think soaked her feet in cat piss. Keep. Your. Shoes. On. Even if WW caves. Keep. Them. On. Busy mom is already wearing yoga pants, so she can afford the extra bulk from her whatever shoes.
Stickers. I know a guy. We'll call him Shmouis. He took a couple of boxes of bravos from his home location when he read the email. It all fits nicely with my side-riff about WW "listening" to members about the rewards and such. So, while I'm sad to see them go, I know that it provides me additional fodder. Busy mom doesn't want her kids finding her Bravo stash and sticking them to the bathroom mirror.
As for time. It was supposed to be a 30 minute meeting. Not 45 minutes to an hour as some leaders have morphed into. Busy mom has shït to do.
We're all old school (for the most part). We take the 'weight' in Weight Watchers at face value. New regime doesn't because they see where things are going long term. And that's what stock prices are based on. Busy mom has a 401k that needs pumping up.
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Post by debsback on Jul 31, 2018 11:59:32 GMT
So how do they know who uses the app and who needs to have them wrote down the weight and points for the week? Actually this discussion just spurred me to look at MFP and the Lose It apps, so thanks for that!
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Post by linda72 on Jul 31, 2018 12:11:00 GMT
louisstone, thanks for your insight. Spot on post, as usual!
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